I've had a look at this particular mod and honestly, I can see too many ways to abuse it.
Farms not working? Cut and paste to single player.
Find what could be a base, signs of player activity ...cut and paste to single player.
I'm sure with that kinda data you could even attempt to get the seed.
Genuine concern.
Thank you.
@GondolaMan I've had a look at this particular mod and honestly, I can see too many ways to abuse it.
Farms not working? Cut and paste to single player.
Find what could be a base, signs of player activity ...cut and paste to single player.
I'm sure with that kinda data you could even attempt to get the seed.Genuine concern.
Thank you.
While I agree that there are ways to abuse this mod, if people truley wanted to cheat and do such things there are much easier mods that u can use to do such things... In order to find "signs of player activity" You yourself have to go out and load the chunks yourself and by that point youve basically already loaded the chunks.... To do such things would take a LOT longer than it would be worth. What do you consider wrong with copy and pasting a farm that doesnt work from multiplayer to singleplayer? Not actually trying to fight you on this just curious why this is such a problem? Admins/Crafty go into detail to see what all can be abused for mods that can possibly be abused which is why they take quiet a bit of time to approve said mods. To add on to this you could really argue every mod has a kind of form of cheating. Bobby mod when the server is lagging can basically xray and show basically what u would see in spectator if a chunk fails to load. Every mod can be abused.
The problem is, is that the other ways are illegal, banned, not allowed. The fact you also see the potential for abuse should surely make you want it banned too. I agree you'll never stop cheating, but do not allow a tool that can be used for those purposes.
Farm - if it dosnt work, you built it wrong. Learn, figure it out. This mod isny only widely open to abuse but, in my opinion its paint by number too.
The main reason for mods being disallowed is due to them offering unfair advantages to other players. Its ticks every box. The average player would not know the potential expliots that would indeed be available to them.
These are just my concerns, if the mod remains, it remains. But i feel i should at least voice my concerns.
@GondolaMan The problem is, is that the other ways are illegal, banned, not allowed. The fact you also see the potential for abuse should surely make you want it banned too. I agree you'll never stop cheating, but do not allow a tool that can be used for those purposes.
Farm - if it dosnt work, you built it wrong. Learn, figure it out. This mod isny only widely open to abuse but, in my opinion its paint by number too.
The main reason for mods being disallowed is due to them offering unfair advantages to other players. Its ticks every box. The average player would not know the potential expliots that would indeed be available to them.
These are just my concerns, if the mod remains, it remains. But i feel i should at least voice my concerns.
So by your logic Optifine should be banned, Bobby should be banned because both of these mods CAN be abused. Also what is this "I agree you'll never stop cheating, but do not allow a tool that can be used for those purposes." I dont cheat. Litematica I only use for building lmfao. Bobby the whole spectator thing isnt my fault and I dont purposefuly do it... it just happens
@ThePhoenix So by your logic Optifine should be banned, Bobby should be banned because both of these mods CAN be abused. Also what is this "I agree you'll never stop cheating, but do not allow a tool that can be used for those purposes." I dont cheat. Litematica I only use for building lmfao. Bobby the whole spectator thing isnt my fault and I dont purposefuly do it... it just happens
The degree in which Litematica allows you to exploit, even unintentionally, is almost exactly like x-ray and allows you to pinpoint player made structures with ease- even easier than what I quickly demonstrated in the video I had made. You can get right down to the block, and even see a cross section of what you've located with a schematic like you're in spectator mode. Bobby has some flaws in rendering the chunks where you sometimes see down into the ground, but it's very spotty, distant, and too cumbersome to be consistent, and all around irrelevant considering anything else someone nefarious could use.
Bobby can be a separate discussion, but has absolutely no standing against what Litematica is capable of.
@Casey_Fluffbat The degree in which Litematica allows you to exploit, even unintentionally, is almost exactly like x-ray and allows you to pinpoint player made structures with ease- even easier than what I quickly demonstrated in the video I had made. You can get right down to the block, and even see a cross section of what you've located with a schematic like you're in spectator mode. Bobby has some flaws in rendering the chunks where you sometimes see down into the ground, but it's very spotty, distant, and too cumbersome to be consistent, and all around irrelevant considering anything else someone nefarious could use.
Bobby can be a separate discussion, but has absolutely no standing against what Litematica is capable of.
Can u actually exploit it unintentional? bc Ive been using it for a while now and never seen the "exploit" as you call it
@ThePhoenix Can u actually exploit it unintentional? bc Ive been using it for a while now and never seen the "exploit" as you call it
Unintentionally as in Litematica enables players to exploit, even if that isn't intended.
"Intended" fades out when Litematica is boiled down to it's area selection, analyze, and schematic saving functions which have no restrictions. I find it impossible to argue that it isn't a blatant x-ray, a genre of mod that would not make it on the approved mods list.
@Casey_Fluffbat Unintentionally as in Litematica enables players to exploit, even if that isn't intended.
"Intended" fades out when Litematica is boiled down to it's area selection, analyze, and schematic saving functions which have no restrictions. I find it impossible to argue that it isn't a blatant x-ray, a genre of mod that would not make it on the approved mods list.
I feel like you aren't saying it right. People can exploit with it. Just like they can with every other mod and vanilla... It cant be "unintentional" in that case. Its intentional. and the restrictions are pretty clear... You have to have the chunks loaded... and since mods and admins constnatly spectate people its pretty obvious if someone is using it for xray mining straight to it...
@ThePhoenix I feel like you aren't saying it right. People can exploit with it. Just like they can with every other mod and vanilla... It cant be "unintentional" in that case. Its intentional. and the restrictions are pretty clear... You have to have the chunks loaded... and since mods and admins constnatly spectate people its pretty obvious if someone is using it for xray mining straight to it...
You didn't address the point I'm making. How are these functions, as a part of Litematica, different from x-ray? How does one get approved over the other here?
Yes someone CAN just try to use x-ray anyway, there is no filter for clients sneaking in, but what about attaching a building function to one would make it acceptable? What is the point of the approved mods list?
We ask players not to cheat. That is the same thing we ask of those using litematica. In the same way pieray is banned, abuse of litematica is too. Caseys video was misleading in terms of the high render distance and saying it can be done from anywhere. You cannot just set the coords and get a world download and search for chests. Every chunk has to be manually loaded. Which for those that seek to do you harm would just use an actual cheat client. For those that are worried people will be scouring the world analyzing for bases the steps necessary are so much more difficult than xray or even just using pieray as that updates automatically as chunks get loaded and de-loaded. Mass elytra chunk searching would not only require you to go M>area editor>analyze area>search for your query. Rinse and repeat. There are no keybind shortcuts, and the query does not save. The cache would have to be repeatedly cleansed as well. The amount of keystrokes required to make it work is just not worth any cheaters time. If it looks like x-ray you get banned for x-ray. Whether its pieray abuse, litematica abuse, a bobby render bug, etc. Cheaters that join the server will most likely get banned long before they start running around .wild saving schematics. And on that note, maybe you have a NASA supercomputer to load giant schematics but I certainly don't. The same rules to hide your base from pieray abuse still apply. As far as avoiding letting vines, kelp, bamboo, etc grow too long, etc etc etc. Safest place to store your loot is and always will be an enderchest or a billion miles out in the nether.
As far as Im concerned, Litematica will be kept under review. It is fundamentally a tool the builders enjoy. I will have a look at how easily it can be abused. It was probably the most debated mod request. I dont like it being available myself as it allows copying our builds off the server but respected the collective decision.
Litematica is actually pretty tedious to use. Far from intuitive. I do use it on admin creative builds, and copying competition entries. But I'm sure some of you are quicker at it than me.
@Tez1010 As far as Im concerned, Litematica will be kept under review. It is fundamentally a tool the builders enjoy. I will have a look at how easily it can be abused. It was probably the most debated mod request. I dont like it being available myself as it allows copying our builds off the server but respected the collective decision.
Litematica is actually pretty tedious to use. Far from intuitive. I do use it on admin creative builds, and copying competition entries. But I'm sure some of you are quicker at it than me.
Just to add a little to what you said. Although they can copy Admin builds and stuff. All NBT data on chest, command blocks, etc. don’t get copied as the client side can’t possible know or have access to such things. Not even in single player
@CommanderCat_ We ask players not to cheat. That is the same thing we ask of those using litematica. In the same way pieray is banned, abuse of litematica is too. Caseys video was misleading in terms of the high render distance and saying it can be done from anywhere. You cannot just set the coords and get a world download and search for chests. Every chunk has to be manually loaded. Which for those that seek to do you harm would just use an actual cheat client. For those that are worried people will be scouring the world analyzing for bases the steps necessary are so much more difficult than xray or even just using pieray as that updates automatically as chunks get loaded and de-loaded. Mass elytra chunk searching would not only require you to go M>area editor>analyze area>search for your query. Rinse and repeat. There are no keybind shortcuts, and the query does not save. The cache would have to be repeatedly cleansed as well. The amount of keystrokes required to make it work is just not worth any cheaters time. If it looks like x-ray you get banned for x-ray. Whether its pieray abuse, litematica abuse, a bobby render bug, etc. Cheaters that join the server will most likely get banned long before they start running around .wild saving schematics. And on that note, maybe you have a NASA supercomputer to load giant schematics but I certainly don't. The same rules to hide your base from pieray abuse still apply. As far as avoiding letting vines, kelp, bamboo, etc grow too long, etc etc etc. Safest place to store your loot is and always will be an enderchest or a billion miles out in the nether.
The issue is you don't have to scan every chunk, you just fly until you see player evidence (enderman placed blocks, lava/waterfalls loaded, grass eaten, full grown vegetation, looted structures, portals, creeper craters, items on the ground, oceans where sand/gravel isn't falling, broken kelp that's already at the water's surface, etc etc etc) which is first page, basehunting 101. Whatever someone may use comes AFTER this task, otherwise you're wasting your time. This significantly narrows things down, and with enough of it you can encircle where a base may be.
To add, even just the distribution of villagers or animals away from their spawn origin is evidence.
The fact that we have to have all this debate about whether or not it should be banned seems to be a pretty big red flag in the first place. Regardless of the intent of the players, exploits are still exploits and I believe they should be treated as such.
We shall wait and see what the staff decides.
@CommanderCat_ We ask players not to cheat. That is the same thing we ask of those using litematica. In the same way pieray is banned, abuse of litematica is too.
Couldn't this Rationale be applied to Lunar Client as well then? 90% of people would it be using it as a FPS booster, especially people on older machines. You could just ask players not to use the mini map or HUD modifications.
@CommanderCat_ If it looks like x-ray you get banned for x-ray
If someone finds a base using the part of Lunar Client thats not allowed, cant they just be just banned for xray as well?
@TheProph3tx Couldn't this Rationale be applied to Lunar Client as well then? 90% of people would it be using it as a FPS booster, especially people on older machines. You could just ask players not to use the mini map or HUD modifications.
If someone finds a base using the part of Lunar Client thats not allowed, cant they just be just banned for xray as well?
There are other APPORVED mods that help reduce FPS. Lunar client isnt an approved mod. Simple as that.
While there are other approved Mods that boost FPS, Lunar Client is one of the best out there. But I'm not here to talk about other approved mods, I'm here talking about 2 mods and how they are similar.
My main point is both would primarily benefit the user experience, depending on the situation. But both of them have gray areas for sure that can be abused against others in the server. If a mod has the possibly to be abused and staff is expecting the player base to not use it, other beneficial mods with gray areas should be brought back into consideration.
I understand why Lunar Client is not allowed, but that same reasoning should be applied to Litematica as it has the potential to be abused. If Litematica is kept approved, It opens the door to other beneficial mods that have the possibly of harming the vanilla survival experience.
Thanks
